Episode 2 - Managing Changes in the Creative Process

Key Takeaways:

• Introduction to Episode Two: The Margateers, Margaret Sherer and Margaret Bouse, continue their discussion on marketing processes, focusing on the challenges and solutions of rebriefing.
• Adventures in the Rebrief Process: They explore the dynamics of needing to rebrief projects due to various internal and external changes, such as mergers, acquisitions, or shifts in strategic goals.
• Managing Rebrands and Rebriefs: Insights into managing major rebrands during mergers and the emotional and operational shifts required.
• Strategic Considerations: The importance of anchoring marketing efforts in strategic outcomes, ensuring every project aligns with broader business goals.
• The Emotional Investment in Marketing Projects: They discuss how emotional investment indicates the significance of a project and how to harness this passion positively.
• Challenges of Scope Creep: Experiences with managing scope creep and maintaining project integrity and budget control.
• Best Practices for Client-Agency Relationships: Advice on fostering effective communications and setting clear expectations to manage changes and scope adjustments.

Synopsis:

- The Margeteers kick off the episode with an introduction to their topic: the adventures and challenges in the rebrief process in marketing.

- They share personal stories reflecting the complexities of rebriefing during unexpected situations like mergers or strategic shifts.

- Discussion on managing rebrands and marketing strategies during organizational changes, emphasizing the need to stay aligned with revised business outcomes.

- They talk about the emotional aspects of marketing projects, how to deal with emotional investments, and managing client and team expectations during turbulent phases.

- Conversation shifts to handling scope creep, with strategies to maintain project integrity and budget, and the importance of transparent communication between clients and agencies.

- The Margeteers delve into best practices for maintaining a good relationship with marketing agencies and the balance between flexibility and project discipline.

- They wrap up by discussing how to use emotional investment positively and preparing for changes in marketing projects with proactive communication and planning.

- The episode concludes with an invitation to the listeners to share their own stories of successful or problematic briefs on LinkedIn.

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Transcript

[00:00:00] Okay,
let's do it. I am Margaret. And I'm Margaret. And we're the margeteers ERs.
In episode two, the margeteers discuss adventures in the reef process.
But that's, yeah, that one I can, I just remember so clearly that day of like, Oh no, everyone's upset. I go, every, and I go, and I'm in the middle of it, because somehow I designed a system that I'm in the middle of it. You know, um, but then I, but then equally there was, I sort of wanted to go back to everyone and be like, Guess what?
Everyone's upset. [00:01:00] It's great. You're not alone. Right, right. Which is a little bit different, but. Yeah
You
Hi Marg. Hi Margaret. How are you? Good, how are you? Good. I just wanted to check in. Um, ok so last we spoke we were talking about creating a brief and the best, um, our, our Bye bye. Best opinions on how to create something that's really impactful when you're starting to work out with a new strategic partner, a new agency, new fractional CMO.
Um, but now we wanted to shift a little bit to the very, very classic rebrief. Situation and so you issued your your brief. You issued your campaign. There's a whole vision. There's a [00:02:00] timeline and in the middle. Something has happened, right? Um, you know, yeah, some something has happened. We don't know what it is.
Sometimes it's an outcome because they haven't done enough. At the beginning to know what that strategic outcome is. Sometimes there's, there's greater forces that are in play that's happened. So I'm curious about, I think we both have a big story of what's up. You know, one of those. Um, I don't personally believe this is from an old manager.
Uh, so there's no marketing emergencies. And I agree with that in the scheme of the world. Um, but a rebrief. Okay. When you've already are in motion is a heart palpitating moment To stop and go. Oh, no So I was curious if you could um share any story that you have about Being through a rebrief. How do you handle it?
And what [00:03:00] advice do you have? To other people who there may be their project has changed mid swing. Oh interesting. So, um, Let's move, uh, client side for a second, um, because in the corporate. History, I've gone through a number of mergers and acquisitions where you were literally in the middle of a campaign or you were in the middle of a, um, you know, a fiscal year where you had budgeted out specific projects.
Um, and then you go through an MNA. So, um, to use, to use one example without naming names, you know, we had started out as a, company that was very focused on countermeasures for terrorism. And, uh, yeah, and focusing a lot on technology that's, um, I always say used in sandy places. Um, and, uh, you know, our, [00:04:00] our, Our visual communications and our messaging changed drastically.
Um, I, I use this terminology that we switched from being camo, um, to red, white, and blue. And that's because we went from this military focus to a focus on protecting and serving the lives of the American people. And so, um, you know, the foundational messaging was very different. The aesthetics were wildly different.
We went from Pictures of our technology being used in military applications to pictures of our technology being used in order to afford people, you know, privileges that they have in their life, whether that's through travel or driving or any number of things. And so as you can imagine, there were quite a few campaigns in process.
There was a website that needed to be completely redone. Um, all of the brochures and [00:05:00] messaging, uh, in addition to any active campaigns, advertising, and we were just starting on the social, uh, at the time, right? It was just becoming a thing. Um, and so I, I think. One of the things to acknowledge is that sometimes it's not just a creative brief about a project that's in the works, sometimes you're revamping the entire creative philosophy of an organization because you're going through some sort of merger, acquisition, or You know, uh, maybe a change because you've been told you need to change your messaging.
Um, you know, legislatively or whatever the case may be. So, yeah, I, it was definitely an interesting project. I would say again. In a prior episode, we talked about the business outcomes. The business outcomes have to be the rubric by [00:06:00] which everything marketing is done. Um, a lot of people think of marketing as very kind of warm, touchy feely.
Um, but in reality, real marketing is very, um, scientific. Um, it's very, uh, uh, you know, planning KPI oriented, objectives oriented. Um, and I can't think of anything that's a bigger reset than the complete, you know, acquisition or merger of a company where you're, where you're changing the foundational principles of your why.
And did you have to do that through phases? Like what was the excitement? I've been through that, you know, I'll talk a bit about being like going through rebrands, which happen, um, frequently, but like, did you have different phases or was there anything that had been contractually obligated in conversations you hadn't even been a part of, but like, no, this all, we want this date for whether it's market [00:07:00] reasons or other kinds of things.
It was definitely done in phases because simply the size of the organization and our ability to execute. Um, so, you know, I would say the lesson learned there is just make sure that you're prioritizing the things that give you the greatest lift the soonest. Things like the corporate brochure, the website, and anything, if it's a public company, anything that needs to go out in your formal filings, um, to, you know, reposition the company.
It's why And kind of what the business is, um, you know, those things have to be prioritized. And then the next layer of down, you know, the next layer down of things can be done, you know, brochures, et cetera, getting your proposals rejiggered, you know, all the things that you need to do to make sure that every message, not just your marketing message, but all your foundational communications.
get adjusted across [00:08:00] every media channel. Um, was your agency be able to flip quite quickly for you, or were you doing it mostly, mostly in house? Um, we did a little bit of both. So, uh, yeah, we had a, we had a CMO at the time at corporate that managed an outside agency who helped. Um, and then we just kind of executed against that also with an internal team.
It was a good blend. Was there any, was there any kind of pushback from your own marketing team or just everyone knew it had to be done? Um, everybody knew it had to be done. Okay. That's a little bit. And you kind of wanted it, right? Because the, the, the new, the new mission and approach was very, it was very inspiring.
There was something that you could really get behind and. Yeah, the culture of our, um, CEO for our division [00:09:00] at that time, he just did a beautiful job of really making sure that we had a really nice cultural adjustment. Um, And, uh, you know, it was very well done over, over a period of time too. Right. Cause it's not a light switch.
Um, the culture came over a period of time. Um, but really gave you something to rally behind something that you felt proud to be a part of something where you knew you were doing something really special for your customers. And, um, Yeah, so it was an emotional process too, in a good way. I can imagine. Um, I was thinking of, from agency side, there's a situation where we're doing a mega project, like, I think it was our biggest project of the agency.
I think we're in our second year then. And, uh, it's my client I brought [00:10:00] in, it was very exciting. It was a global. Search space client, whatever. Um, and it was going to be this first of its kind and this kind of like we were doing video and this is the first time. It's funny to think how new video actually is.
And now, you know, we've hit the points that I was using for years by, you know, 2023, 82 percent of the internet is going to be video. So we have to redo the video and so forth. And now we've hit these points and I don't even know if that's true with 82%, but it's certainly something I used to say. Uh, but, uh, But at that time we were making video, which was a hero video, and then two cutups of a beautiful case study, and they were going to be used in different channels.
So it was a really invigorating project because it was kind of new to having these different, now YouTube will auto cut, right? And do all the smart cutting and everything for your videos. But at the time we needed, um, the agency to do it. And it was such a big project. In one instance, we're [00:11:00] at a client.
Our clients and clients, um, warehouse, we built a studio inside their warehouse to get these beautiful shots. It's actually like a coffee. So it was very visual and beautiful. And there's this whole dynamic, like storytelling that we have for each country. We're flying out to France. Um, just to remind people I live in the UK, even though I sound like this, uh, so, you know, it's our UK base and we're flying to France, we're flying to Spain.
And I think about halfway through the project, we got told they were going through, the client was going through a whole new name. And they were going to completely rebrand and they were going to have a whole new name. And. I will admit it completely freaked me out because we had so much in the can. It had been such a big investment.
It was such a big moment for us as an agency. Um, but for me, I was quite lucky because the client kept saying, it's going to be fine. It doesn't change the story. It doesn't change the story. I'm like, what does it change? [00:12:00] You're saying that, but how are we going to retell a story? Like, I just didn't really believe that it was just a name change, if you will, because tends to be heads of brand.
Say a name change and then there's as you just mentioned has how you did that in waves that seemed there was going to be different waves and so then were they going to immediately dump this project and that kind of thing. Luckily it really was in the end just a name change and just like a lockup change.
Lockup is the um, end screens you see in a video to give that final call to action or CTA. Um, so the only thing that got held up was. Well, my heart rate for a while, but other than that was, was just getting the assets to us because coming from the US and how to make sure we had, you know, the unified space, but it really was this kind of few, few weeks of saying, Oh my goodness, months and flights.
And, you know, in [00:13:00] this case, we're telling very humanistic stories. So we're in other, other businesses disrupting their businesses. I was like, Oh my gosh, how are we going to go back and say. We need to disrupt you for a whole nother day, um, because it's, it's really big. So that really worked out, but there is that, there is that real panic of, will this still be strategic of what you set out to be?
Will you, as a client, even though you're the person doing it to me, quote unquote, doing it, you know, whatever, like, will you still be happy? Like, are we being as flexible as you need us to be? Cause that's a, I mean, that's a mega, mega rebrief. Like both of the situations we shared are like, those are very, very big things.
But I think what's most likely on like a day to day is agency work is you kind of get halfway through and then there's something you want to add into it. And there's that other part of a rebrief of saying, well, Oh wait, can we squeeze this part in? And it, and I think there's that also. Um, there's always a [00:14:00] fine line of like, that's a whole new project that comes with cost implications, that's has a different outcome than what we're going to, but I guess that just has to deal with like the, the trust that you have with your clients to be able to have those transparent.
conversations and be able to, to move forward. Yeah. Deciding when you consider it to be scope creep versus it's just a tweak, right? A tweak and scope creep have big implications, right? The difference. Um, yeah. Um, cause sometimes it's like, Oh, you know, can we change the messaging in the, you know, this third theme that we have in the video?
You know, okay, well, we need to redo voiceovers and it's going to need a couple more shots. Um, I'm getting nervous you just saying that I'm like, But if it's if it's if it's happening, you know, the day of. That's great. If it happens 10 [00:15:00] days later and you've already torn down the set and you know, now, now it has real implications.
There's a big cost associated with going back and doing the rework. Um, I will say, Oh, sorry. I was, I was just gonna say it's, it's important to, you know, one things I found with these long tail projects, um, is just doing a level set each morning, almost like a, uh, a software scrum meeting, like, okay. Today the day the goal is this, this, this, and this and finding out in real time.
Is there any Creep any scope creeper, any change anticipated that we should be talking about today before we hit the go button. Um, and doing those little check ins, I think, allow you to do little tweaks in real time so that you don't get to the end and then have a recast. I have to say that's, uh, I think you're nicer than me to be able to give that aspect of like, I don't, I try [00:16:00] not to give any room for change once it's locked down because there's so many other changes that happen, you know, throughout anyway.
And so it's trying to say, okay, these are the X. I do like the, like, these are the expectations. These are timelines. Okay. This has happened on our side. This changes the timeline, you know, these kinds of things just to keep it more transparent and open. But I, um, in time and in an experience. I'll say, well, that sounds like a new project.
And I'm also, you know, I'm not talking about major rework. It's just, you know, just little check ins on the daily while a long tail project is happening, I think helps make sure that you don't wind up at the end with a big ask. Um, and you know, reality too, like if I think about a video project, for example, there's a little bit of You know, nuance and adjustment that [00:17:00] happens in real time anyway, right?
So there's like, okay, like we, you know, we had storyboarded this out with this being the angle and we were planning on, you know, X, Y, Z, but now with the lighting and seeing it and seeing what we just did, you know, we think that we can. We think that we should make an adjustment. So some things just happen organically in real time anyway.
So having, having a little bit of flexibility, I think in there is really important for me, where I draw the line is if there's a, if there's a real cost implication, so there's a cost implication to the talent, or it's going to increase, you know, uh, edit time, you know, there's going to be things where there's, you know, I usually have a little bit of a buffer planned into a project anyway, but where I see where it could have an impact that would take us beyond that buffer, you know, then it's like, okay, this is scope creep and you know, here's either how we can accommodate it or [00:18:00] here's the trade offs or just saying no, it really, it really depends on the situation from the buy side of securing an agency and working with an agency.
My personal experience has been that. If they were too difficult to work with and too rigid, then I also didn't want to work with them again. So, you know, I, I try and be reasonable when I'm the client and like, okay, I understand that will cost more. I understand that changes the delivery date. Right? Um, but at the end of the day, I'm the client, and I want to see that change done.
Like, yes, it's a scope creep, but we need to do the scope creep. Or, yes, it's a messaging change, but we need to do the messaging change. And then if there's an implication to the price, then we pay the price. I mean, that's the decision that you make as the client. Yeah, but I think that that's, Rare than you think it is.
I think that there's a lot more of the I'm the [00:19:00] client and do it versus And I will be pay for that difference
I think it comes down to integrity. I mean a client A client. Sorry, I shouldn't laugh. It's absolutely true It's absolutely true but I think that some of the people think that they probably do have integrity and this is more maybe lack of flexibility for it's it's I mean look it's a total case by case situation and there's You And there's those times where you have to see of, of how do you robust it?
But there's, I don't know, I've been on a couple of projects where you get very deep down and they've been, you know, canceled because maybe the expectations were, even though you did all the expectations all the way through and. The deciding factor, I don't know. I think they would when I'm getting into different space, but it's just like, I think that they think that there is integrity and there is a space and I'm the client and client's always right in that aspect, but I it's, it's harder with, I think, smaller businesses to say [00:20:00] with, when you have kind of some smaller budgets to be able to say, Oh no, we can't, you know, I can't lose the money and I can't, but I changed my, you know, Plan halfway through and therefore everybody has to pay for it, right?
Don't you find having like a practical? conversation Because people understand that Resources have to be funded. So sometimes it comes down to I think of a business conversation as opposed to a creative Conversation. Um, you'd hope so. I mean, a lot of logic to it. Yeah, I mean, I think you'd hope so. And you'd hope that's what happened.
And luckily, it's been few and far between. But when it does happen, it's it feels it feels bigger. It feels really, you know, it's, it's, it's There's a lot more feelings involved than just saying like feeling like someone's trying to take advantage or trying to squeeze something out or [00:21:00] like the the and and and and say well you did that last week why won't you do it and it's like because you used up all of the goodwill and now you can't do it like that's a harder conversation to have and it kind of I think I would do that more now than I would have.
When I was starting the business seven years ago, you know, you want to be accommodating. You want to be, um, you want to show that you deliver what you say you're going to deliver. And you're like, Oh, okay, things change, but I don't know.
It's interesting how the, how the life lessons steer you towards the, the perspectives that help you basically manage your business and manage your client's expectations better. And this was more. To me versus like best practice for agencies. I think I'm wholly accommodating I think I like if I can I'll try to accommodate where we can and I think is when I come back and I'm like That's that's a different resource.
That's [00:22:00] scoop creeper. That's something else. I think what's hard for me to say is I'm If it's coming from me, then like something really has gone amiss. Like you have needed to take something much bigger and so forth. I'm thinking about there is one project. This wasn't necessarily, um, uh, scope creep. It was, it was a little bit like there was kind of different objectives that sort of changed.
There's creative process that change. And there was this one Wednesday. I can't, it was a December Wednesday, which in the UK is a very, very dark day. And. All of, and the client was set. Was upset and all my suppliers were upset. So my designer was upset. My senior designer, my senior writer, my very big client, and everyone was upset.
And I'm kind of the hub of everybody. And the only thing to do is actually, I just went and took a bath because I was like, I can't figure this out to really make sure that everyone is working in the same direction, you know, saying, okay, like, how do we accommodate the The [00:23:00] frustrations of design timeline or how much of writing is going to be edited by the client and, and should we have it by different spaces, you know, should the client be that involved with editing because they've given us the brief and now they're changing it so much.
And that was a really, that was a really difficult day. Um, And then it's kind of, but again, it comes back to that reset of them going back and saying, look, here's what, here's what I think went wrong yesterday. Here's how I think we're going to fix it. Um, I understand that you wanted to change some of the creative in this particular way.
We're obviously halfway through there's a print deadline. There's, you know, there's all these other things to do. So it's just a different way of going back and saying. Let's let's all become back on the same team. Let's all go start looking in the same direction, which is kind of, um, it's how I like to work anyways, being that we're all facing the same direction, but kind of a pause moment that I that I returned to [00:24:00] when I can to just say, Can we all just stop and go actually go back to the brief?
What was the point of the project? How did we veer off complete track? Are we just, you know, are there expectations that need to be refocused on? Um, But that's, yeah, that one I can, I just remember so clearly that day of like, Oh no, everyone's upset. I go every, and I go, and I'm in the middle of it. Cause somehow I designed a system that I'm in the middle of it, you know?
Um, but then I, but then equally there was, I sort of wanted to go back to everyone and be like, guess what? Everyone's upset. It's great. You're not alone. Which is a little bit different, but yeah. It's interesting that. I mean, one of the, one of the takeaways that I have when those kinds of situations happen, it's that thank goodness you're working on a project that people consider important enough that they're emotionally invested [00:25:00] in it.
Yeah. And so, you know, taking that emotion and, and redirecting that towards the outcome, I think is a good thing. You know, I've had a couple of engagements where the customer just didn't even really either care or understand. And you know, that's a whole different, that's a whole different kind of issue when they're, when they don't care enough.
So I like, I like it when they get emotional because it means that it's meaningful. Cool.
Um. No, it's true. It is, you know, when we get there in the end, but it's not in that situation, but there are certain situations where there's more emotions that are necessary, that are, that come up, that are required. You're like, well, it's going to be fine because there's no marketing emergencies. It's going to be fine.
Anyway, that's really interesting. Thanks for [00:26:00] sharing that story, Mark. It's, it's, you know, Probably a lot more common than I realize is somebody comes in and your dramatic story of it being a mergers and acquisitions. I think it can be equally impactful or And I don't know if that was a stressful change for you, but like when you have a new manager, you know, when you have like when a new person enters, there is that kind of rebrief situation of why are you doing those campaigns, shut them down the middle or something like that.
So I'm guessing that that story is going to resonate with a lot of people. Well, um, it can also be scary too. Right? So you can, you can choose how you're going to deal with it. And so I chose to be excited and inspired. Um, and most people chose to be excited and inspired. You know, a few people were scared of it.
Um, it all worked out great in the end. Like it was, it was an awesome rebrand. [00:27:00] I think that's an exciting one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was really good. Life gets in the way. There's going to be team changes. There's going to be, um, brand changes. There's going to be mergers acquisitions. There's going to be, you know, some emotions that, that people bring to it because maybe the expectations really weren't set in that particular, um, original brief state.
And I think as long as you kind of come at it with. you know, not to be cheesy, but like a positive mindset that like, if you're going to expect some sort of changes, it makes it a bit easier when they actually do, uh, come. And then just as a team, you have to decide what's acceptable for scope, create for, you know, I, I gave that Example of the, the rebrief where they are going to continue the project.
There wasn't an anything really changing as far as, um, fees or anything. It was just getting ready for how we were going to change the part of [00:28:00] it. But as long as you're like all anchored in that space, that maybe something's going to happen. This is how we're going to deal with it. Maybe there's going to be some financial implications depending on how much you creep out of it, creep out of the original briefing, but then still stay focused on the business outcomes and the purpose of the project.
And, uh, honest communication will get you there every time. I love that. Um, and I, I definitely second the whole concept of the, the context being the business outcomes for sure. And for me, another takeaway is just that little, Run of show thing in the, you know, in the morning, like, here's what we're doing today and just setting the expectations so that people feel like they're communicated with, they understand what the scope is, what the approach is for the day.
And I think that that helps alleviate any kind of [00:29:00] big kind of changes or adjustments that people want to do at the end, after you've already invested it all, but. the time and sets and talent, um, in order to, to execute the project.
We've really enjoyed speaking about the brief process and what we're both curious to know is a time where a brief went really, really well, or when it or when it went really, really wrong. So please head over to LinkedIn, look up the marketeers, and comment and let us know. Thank you. Thank you.